observer

Posted on 28-08-2012 11:12 | By The author of this comment has been removed.

well ...rip out all the car parks and plant grass ..that will help....yeah right Time to get some professionals on board and fire the current council

Tauranga is going backwards ....

Posted on 28-08-2012 11:41 | By wreck1080

Very very little development happens here. Any sparks of activity are quickly squashed by council and/or maori concerns (eg, bayfair mall expansion, marine farming in katikati).

Killing the host.

Posted on 28-08-2012 12:04 | By SpeakUp

It's no wonder that business and commercial enterprise cannot cope any longer with the sponging exploitation of various sucking parasites. First and biggest suckers are the local Councils. Multi-layered bureaucratic hydras, they curtail free enterprise with their everlasting imposition in the free market. They set up myriads of regulations that kill free market competition. They hassle visitors with pernicious parking rules/enforcement. They raise rates to fund their outrageous suckerdom. They create compliance rules with help of inventive consultant scammers. Their marketing chums sell these oppressions as having purpose and well intent but instead they strangle free enterprise. They have a public funded litigation army behind their extortion processes. No one can afford to fight this private property thieving Moloch. Us debt slaves cannot escape from the debt shackles administration puts on us. The collaborator (and in many matters the instigator) in this larceny is(was) central government. With over-the-top regulation they necessitate far-reaching and excessive local compliance cost. The left arm doesn't know what the right arm is already thieving and both are perplexed when the free market struggles and falters. They will not rest until the host is destroyed. Then they themselves will greatly suffer. At that stage it will be too late and serious harm will befall economy and society. The do-gooder parasites will deny any responsibility. Lice have no cognizance. ‘Local Government Reform' cannot clean out this filth soon enough. -Citizen Monitoring Council-

Its all been said before

Posted on 28-08-2012 12:04 | By Butch

Tauranga needs to establish a point of difference and attract visitors to the C.B.D, a decent waterfront would help, but we need to be thinking of Tauranga as a conference center, and market it accordingly, but unfortrunately with the Strand the way it is who wants to spend any time in the area, bring the Historic Village up to Cliff Road, cobblestone the Strand, clean up the bars, have some green space around, and maybe visitors may feel safe, and want to shop and part with a dollar or two, do not blame the economic downturn for the problems in the C.B.D that is way to easy, and is not all the cause, make it into a "niche" shopping area, the malls can have the chain stores, what we are going to end up with here is wall to wall discount stores!, and a dead city.

OBSTACL COURSE

Posted on 28-08-2012 12:25 | By PLONKER

Business finds the CBD a problem, not least of the long list is parking, no parking means no customers spending money, no job ... this is obvious. But of course a TCC official has not got even the slightest clue about that.

CBD

Posted on 28-08-2012 12:37 | By donmac

Poor Speakup - can't read! And does not understand the current business climate. I certainly would not invest in a CBD hotel when I couldn't make money out of it. Also, in my experience, NZ is one of the most business-friendly city in the world and Tauranga is one of the most business supportive in the country. Speakup has been watching too much TV to understand what goes on in the real world.

Actions speak louder than words

Posted on 28-08-2012 12:52 | By NoKonei

Leadership is seen in deeds not in words - turn your moans into actions, then maybe someone will take notice.

Rastus

Posted on 28-08-2012 12:57 | By rastus

It should be no surprise that things are tough for business in the CBD. A few years back our council called for submissions from the public as to how the CBD should grow - many very good submissions were made but were any of them listened to - NO, instead what has happened is that at ratepayers expense (Business ratepayers) a shonkey outfit called P1 has surreptitiously taken over and is now a very useless tail wagging the dog. What if any intelligence has this outfit got that collectively (shown through their submissions) the real players in this game - the people who generate the wealth of the city have not got. To blame the downturn of the CBD on the international economy is nothing more than fatuous bovine excreta. For several years now the CBD engine has been constricted while the suburban malls have expanded. There are only so many expendable dollars and simple concepts such as really addressing 'free parking' and many of the things that 'SpeakUp' mentions would have made the difference and although such sensible approaches could still work it is going to be an uphill battle to refill the vacant shops and to make the CBD a great shopping experience again for Joe Public. The last thing we need is some upstart blaming everything but the root causes.

LEECHES

Posted on 28-08-2012 13:51 | By PLONKER

Seakup, your writings are become a bit to close to the truth, the officials will be looking to shut you down, for the sake of cowardly self preservation I think you best reactivate the censorship rules upon yourself. Just a suggestion ...

kapa

Posted on 28-08-2012 14:24 | By kapa

I concur with all that is said

Hotel canned as CBD struggles

Posted on 28-08-2012 15:01 | By algail

When has any council or Govt ever taken up a public submission or even considered them seriously?. Very rare I would say. The downturn of the CBD of Tauranga will gradually get worse as the years pass and noting will be done about till we get rid of the current council. If only the citizens of Tauranga would or could open their eyes and see the rotten council they have then we would get a change. The madness of a city university beggars belief more parking gone , less people will shop in the CBD because of the difficulty of finding somewhere tro aprk a car. The university will never be able to grow in the proposed locations s it will need to as times passes. The mad project is a project for real boom times not a recession. There are many better locations for such a building in the Tauranga district but they can't be seen by fools. Another problem is the extremely high rates in Tauranga such high rates demand high rates so shape make less profit and as it has become obvious shops are closing down, more shops will close as time passes. Now parking fees. I wonder would the money collected cover the cost of maintenance of the meters, the collection of the money from t he meters and the wages for the wardens. Lets do away with parking fees. There are no fees in Greerton and they seem to do Ok and I have no trouble finding a park there. Greerton is run by the same hopeless council so how can they be unaware that no parking fees works in Greerton. One of the reasons people drive to Greerton to shop is the easy parking which is free and no fear of a ticket and a fine. If they stopped the parking fees more would shop in the CBD. Of course people shop in malls, free parking, get it? Re the comment on the wrost winter ever I wonder have the warmists noted that Alastair Bethlehem

And yet ...

Posted on 28-08-2012 15:50 | By Murray.Guy

The same Council meeting had presentations from the Mainstreet organisations of Greerton and Mount Maunganui. In stark contrast to the City Centre Mainstreet and Priority One, Greerton and the Mount reported very positively, acknowledging the economy wasn't bursting, with no building vacancies at Greerton and only a handful at the Mount, and a myriad of successful, self funded promotions. It's time TCC established how much it wanted another hotel, what it is prepared to concede to get one, and put the hotel site out in the public environment in a transparent tender process. Keep TCC ego driven pretenders out of the equation and let the 'private sector' do what they are best at'.

Posted on 28-08-2012 16:12 | By traceybjammet

what about the parking stations that are already there the waterfront needs to be an attraction area. how about free parking and/or buses if you can show a docket from a inner-city store/restaurant etc. Obviously that will have to be sorted out funding wise but innercity shopping in every city of the world suffers due to malls oh hang on they are going to build another one at Bureta just what we need, NOT!! Personally I am not a fan of malls as a shopping and day out experience

@ PLONKER

Posted on 28-08-2012 16:39 | By SpeakUp

Thanks mate, appreciate your concern/satire. Although we live in a de-mock-racy (google ‘Totalitarian democracy'), we're not living in a gulag (yet) and the 'officials' are still public servants. Bring it on I'd say. Pilfers don't like publicity. THEY better watch what they're doing because they might eventually be held accountable. History shows that once TSHTF the populace can be quite grumpy and unforgiving to busy-body spendthrift functionaries nursing a Messiah complex. 'Free election of masters does not abolish the masters or the slaves” -Herbert Marcuse-

TCC PUSHING HOTEL FOR YEARS

Posted on 28-08-2012 18:16 | By WOMBLE

If the CBD was setup and run properly, i.e. the WOMBLES went back into there nice cozy little holes and stayed there, stopped thinking, did some praying for the soul, spent nothing, said nothing then private business would take off and the CBD would florish as it should.

dead tauranga

Posted on 28-08-2012 19:30 | By Alanah

We have all the attributes in Tauranga to market a great amount of tourism but little minded small people stop every single thing for all there various creative reasons and the Maori issues are a block on every corner they are sabotaging their own ancestry from having a fruitful and prosperous life and are blinded to it.

CBD STUFFED

Posted on 28-08-2012 22:05 | By PLONKER

No parking available means no shoppers, simple really.

NOT ENOUGH HANDOUTS ...

Posted on 28-08-2012 22:26 | By PLONKER

Clearly TCC could not muster up a huge enough subsidy to make a deal behind closed doors, seems not a lot has changed at city hall

not playing any more

Posted on 29-08-2012 07:24 | By spanky

FREE PARKING!!! Seriously. Recently I parked outside a shop to buy an item. for whatever reason I was unfortunate enough to pick the one day they DIDNT open at 9. I decided to wait in the sunshine with the others that obviously didnt know either, and as I didnt have any change and i was supposed to just run straight in and grab what i wanted and be gone in 5 mins, and because i was there before the meter timing started I didnt feed the meter. $40! that cost me. $10 ok, naughty me, $20 ouch, but $40! vowed and declared that was it. no more shopping down town I'll go to fraser cove, over to the mount or bayfair where you can browse at your leisure without having to constantly watch the time for fear of getting a fine. Twice before I've parked at one end of town and gone for an unplanned browse but had to cut my shopping short to get back to the car. Councils greed has cost retailers sales.

@Murray Guy

Posted on 29-08-2012 08:48 | By Phailed

But why then did your Council buy out a private Speedway business? How about some consistency here?

Killing the City

Posted on 29-08-2012 12:45 | By morepork

There are 2 main things that are killing the CBD: parking during the day and lawlessness at night. I used to go into town a few times a week just to browse around and shop, and at night it was pleasant to enjoy some of the restaurants in the City (which are generally of a high standard.) Nowadays I go to town maybe once a month and only when I HAVE to. It is all just too hard finding parking, and prices have escalated because City based businesses (including restaurants/bars) are being charged ridiculous rates. The Strand is no longer a safe place to be at night with drunken/drugged idiots spoiling for trouble. (A 16 year old was glassed in the face recently in a city bar; I'd expect that in Glasgow, perhaps, not in Tauranga.) For myself, (and I suspect I'm not the only one), I have found easier places to shop and safer evironments to enjoy an evening out. Frankly, if the City dies, it will be a good thing. Coucil will realise you shouldn't kill the Golden Goose and maybe an effort will be made to clean the place up with stricter enforcement of the Law in bars at night. It's tough for City businesses, but you can't expect people to come if they can't park and if they feel unsafe. And exorbitant rates for City property are simply out of touch. You can expect slightly higher rates if the city is bustling and there is a strong flow of people, but that is declining and it will continue to do so. Mostly for the reasons I have stated. I love Tauranga and I don't want to live anywhere else, but the CBD maybe needs to collapse so it can regenerate.

Rastus

Posted on 29-08-2012 13:09 | By rastus

It is gratifying to see that there are others who can see how Very Very (yes that's two very's) simple it is to understand. Our society in this country adopted the motor vehicle well ahead of most other countries in the world - our whole culture includes the motor vehicle 'However' among us are a whole tribe of Greenie/leather belt making/pottery throwing tree huggers who hate human beings and will do all in their power to stop humans experiencing their culture by constantly trying to ignore the fact that the motor vehicle is a major part of the way we live. Look at all those ridiculous yellow buses running around with a handful of people in them - I would love to see an honest account of how much per passenger kilometer these buses are costing. Having pumped up nobody's, who set themselves up to be advisors to the TCC is a continuing joke - Tauranga continues to grow despite these useless self appointed eggspurts (sorry Experts). To breath fresh air into the CBD we need to provide sufficient parking to allow freedom of parking (Again we have some B'expert tell us that there are sufficient spaces in the CBD to cope with the present and foreseeable future - well the last part is right with the diminishing number of shoppers to the CBD - Have you ever heard such errant nonsense - just have a look at the streets up around the domain and side streets that daily are jamb packed with workers vehicles - How can these idiots (Middle English denoting a person of low intelligence) not understand the basic fundamentals of our society - thank God I am on the last half of my life and not the first

hotel canned

Posted on 29-08-2012 14:58 | By Glen Clova

I trust all you experts in city development made submissions to the council when they were asked for the redevelopment of the strand reclamation.Also i would like to see you standing for council and putting your expertize into action instead of winging all the time.If you want to see empty shops go to Rotorua

What was the deal on offer ??

Posted on 29-08-2012 15:06 | By RORTSCAM

Well anyone who has tried to get information out of any TCC CEO or TCC bureaucrat on the Hotel development and what deals / incentives were on offer got hit with the commercial sensitivity hoary chestnut.Little wonder it has all turned to custard and TCC have worn it in the artz. The involvement of Priority One and the Chamber of Commerce was not a plus.Incidentally what did this futile exercise cost TCC ratepayers ?

observer

Posted on 29-08-2012 19:06 | By The author of this comment has been removed.

I wonder if any them high and mightly in the TCC read these posts because it wouldnt take to much intelligence for them to figure out that the community had had enough of them and their self centered BS !? Nah -propably to busy at a cocktail party somewhere on rate payer funds...

WOULD A COST A FOTUNE!

Posted on 29-08-2012 22:33 | By PLONKER

All the time the officals spent on this, the TCC funded Priority One and all the rest of the knuck heads about the place the bill would be HUMUNGUS and some. The real cost will never be known as it will be liberally distributed around TCC halls from the numerous bloated budgets that no one ever gets to see what is happening and when!

Phailed asks

Posted on 30-08-2012 09:31 | By Murray.Guy

@Murray Guy ... Posted on 29-08-2012 08:48 | By Phailed asks ... "But why then did your Council buy out a private Speedway business? How about some consistency here?" ... No idea what this has to do with a failed hotel deal, but there are commonalities with those involved with the two deals. Council purchased the Speedway business as the agreement put in place by the former CEO, with the support of his 'Yes Men of the day', had the speedway in control of the Baypark site for basically most summer weekends (20 in total). This potentially denied or restricted access to the new $41 million TECT Arena at Baypark. How and why did such an inappropriate agreement get put in place by highly paid professionals and lawyers - we'll never find out and can only guess (dangerous).

@Butch

Posted on 30-08-2012 14:57 | By The Tomahawk Kid

Whats with the "WE" Kimosabe? - I hope you are not meaning COUNCIL! They are the ones responsible for the collapse of the CBD in the first place. Remove council from enforcing the parking - let the retailers, or those whose livelihood depends on people coming into town enforce it - then if they fail it will be their own heads that roll. Im surprised parking tickets are not DOUBLE - it doesnt matter to the council. This hotel has not gone ahead PROBABLY due to the restrictions, requirements and covenants placed on the land that the council own, placing it in the too hard basket for a developer

LEVEL PLAYING FIELD

Posted on 30-08-2012 23:47 | By PLONKER

Council certainly needs to get out of interfering in the CBD, is fact much of the CBD retailing challenges directly relate to the activities of the Council and the feeble attempts to try and be commercial competent, but in fact are completely inept, just don't know it and are incapable of doing or thinking anythign else.

.

Posted on 31-08-2012 16:10 | By PLONKER

Looks to me that the amount is hugely inflated and without any basis other than from and created by the "sparkly minds of Smart Growth or somewhere of similar calibre ... PS you would needs a microscope to spot the talent on this one.

CORO CALAMITY

Posted on 01-09-2012 18:10 | By YOGI

No different, the expectation of something useful and reality are poles apart for both. When will TCC ever learn that the meddling in commercial activities, trying to "make" things happen, interferring willy nilly whenever is just a recipe for disaster every day of the week.

Time to go P1

Posted on 02-09-2012 10:37 | By Accountable

What has Priority One and in particular Duarne Lanksheer and Mainstreet and in particular Kirby Weis achieved for the CBD in the last two years? Absolutely nothing apart from removing the most valuable parking in the city centre and spending huge sums of money doing it and what about the great re branding.What's it all called now? Who knows and who cares.Get rid of these leaches and give the CBD the free parking the customers deserve and let them spend their money without the pressures of fines.Then we can watch the CBD return to a viable place to work and play.

replying to Cr Murray Guy

Posted on 03-09-2012 09:05 | By Phailed

The reason I link the hotel issue with Speedway is because you said "Keep TCC ego driven pretenders out of the equation and let the 'private sector' do what they are best at'." I'd have thought that meant keeping council out of private business. But it looks to me that you should have added except where my mindset thinks it's ok, like a Speedway business. I think consistency is important. I actually agree that the hotel site should be tendered in a "transparent process." Provided by that you mean councillors don't get involved.

ACCOUNTABLE

Posted on 03-09-2012 13:13 | By PLONKER

Yes many years overdue, add to that Smart Growth (not so smart at all) Tourism BOP, Gallery, Route K, and more. They all cost many millions of dollars to ratepayers annually and what they achieve that is useful to anyone is very very hard to find.

THE dWANE AND COSBIE SHOW

Posted on 03-09-2012 15:45 | By YOGI

Looks like one of the scammy deals fo a hotel has fallen over, looks like also that teh Museum monster is also being dragged in teh back down as a "CBD savour" what new and exciting ideas for an excuse will be "creative Tauranga" on this one next year, the year after. There is no way there is $55m of benefits to the CBD from these. There will only be more rates for all to pay and for what?

CBD in nose dive and tail spin

Posted on 03-09-2012 17:50 | By WOMBLE

But I think that the major reason for it being scrapped is that TCC have messed up the CBD so much that it is now in a nose dive and tail spin that is going to be hard to turn around, TCC still can not see the effect of a single decision such as the Strand car parks being axed and the consequence of that decision and what it has on the CBD's ability to trade. Deleting 300 car parks has removed them from being available to joe public, that simply means less people in the CBD, less sales, less jobs and so less tenants, that is actually what we are seeing, and other than TCC everyone else seems to be able to see it beforehand. TCC just can not make the grade on it can they.

ADD TO THIS

Posted on 06-09-2012 12:58 | By YOGI

The excessive troubles over Historic Buildings, like all very silly indeed, all need to move on to bigger and better things. If we had a Taj Mahal I could understand the HPT having some use but otherwise a waste of time, money and space.

CBD EMPTY SHOPS

Posted on 06-09-2012 23:46 | By PLONKER

Where have all the people gone? The shop owners, the staff and the customers, maybe the Hotel TCC scheme propagated by Mainstreet and Priority One just was not rosey enough to get teh Hotel Corp to take the bait. Lucky for ratepayers the only reason that the hand brake got to TCC was that they can not borrow any more and the city is about bankrupt now anyway.

PHAILED RULES

Posted on 06-09-2012 23:49 | By PLONKER

That is why, a booze barn is a nice family friendly type environment, where a supermarket is a big hideous beastly building where ya can nah get a wee drink and drink it!

SHOPPING COMPLEX

Posted on 08-09-2012 12:56 | By TERMITE

Looks like all the proposed shops except the Liquor Store are not currently permitted on the current City plan. Interesting really, that the only a booxe shop is allowed to be built there, strange work really?

MEGA STORE ...

Posted on 11-09-2012 23:46 | By PLONKER

Huge and that just sails though the system, no questions no answers just get out the rubber stamp, all done!

REDUCED BUILDING VALUES

Posted on 12-09-2012 22:47 | By YOGI

Looks more to be about the economic climate reducing values than CHCH!

REAL WORLD

Posted on 13-09-2012 08:15 | By YOGI

Commercial interests will build a Hotel that is best and appropriate for the market place. The reason that to date nothing has happened speaks for itself. Of course such realistic thoughts and ideas as that are way to lofty for the average TCC official and of course any elected member to comprehend anytime this side of the end of the millennium.

CONSULTANTS

Posted on 14-09-2012 11:28 | By TERMITE

I am sure TCC could have paid heaps mor eto a massive amount of consultants to try and make this happen. The consultants would have recommended all manner of wild and crazy notions, anything to make the 'masters' dreams seem real.

Shows that councils and commercial competence aren't a good mix

Posted on 16-09-2012 09:27 | By Phailed

Keep councils out of private enterprise. That includes the precious Baypark and its precious Speedway.

PHAILED

Posted on 17-09-2012 13:50 | By YOGI

Never was and never will be a good mix, in fact they are opposites in every sense of the word.

just

Posted on 17-09-2012 18:35 | By Capt_Kaveman

show them all when the voting arrives as there should be many new ones to choose from = boot them all

Vibrant cities

Posted on 19-09-2012 20:26 | By Papamoaner

Making it easier for people to live in a city centre in say apartments, also flats above shops, makes for a vibrant city.

PAPAMOANER

Posted on 23-09-2012 16:41 | By YOGI

Yes agree apartments are the way to go, especially as there are no car parks so have to get people in to the CBD but without cars.

HOTELS AND WATER

Posted on 26-09-2012 22:02 | By PLONKER

Looks like the Hotel concept of secret/behind closed door meetings is all back on the agenda again, like the Hotel and other shambles of events in the past only show us yet again what kind of mess this lot make when let out in a locked room and teh recorders are off without someone, in fact anyone mature and responsible to contain the bad behaviour and the decisions (that are even worse!).